Getting toddler to speak in minority language

Jen
New Keeper

Posts: 8
Country (residing now): USA
Country (originally from): USA
Children, Ages: 2 daughters, 3 years old and 7 months
Majority Language: English
Minority Language(s): French

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Oct 15, 2017 22:53:45 GMT 9

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Post by Jen on Oct 15, 2017 22:53:45 GMT 9

Hi all,

I'm new to this forum and am glad to have found it!

We live in the US and I speak French with my daughters (almost 3 years old and 7 months old). Their father speaks in English.

My older one understands everything I say. We read books together frequently, we watch "Little Pim" sometimes, I allow occasional iPad games that help with French, we listen to a French radio station daily, in the car I always have French kids songs going...and I talk to her in French as much as possible. I know that exposure is very important, so I'm actively working on that.

If she says things in English to me like "it's a cat", I repeat it in French "c'est un chat". I also act VERY excitedly if she says something in French on her own (this is pretty rare). When "reading" an image book, she probably says about 25% of words in French and if I say "montre moi la vache", she will show me the cow (which is the correct animal!) but she will rarely say it on her own. I also always try to build in new words: if she says "canard" (duck), I'll say "ouiii, c'est un canard jaune!" (yes!!! it's a yellow duck!!). We also use the "sandwich" method a friend told me about if I'm worried about comprehension: "reste la","don't move" "reste la" for instance. Finally, I feel as though I'm constantly describing things. I've read a few books about kids and bilingualism so I definitely have a few tools in my toolbox.

Unfortunately, I sometimes slip-up and accidentally speak to her in English. I've been making an effort to avoid slip-ups, but sometimes it's just what comes out of my mouth first. I speak French completely fluently (I'm actually a French translator and interpreter), but at this point, English is a bit stronger for me, plus everyone around us speaks in English.

So at this point, I'm wondering if I should "ignore" her if she speaks to me in English, which is what another bilingual mom is recommending, but I also don't want to make this a negative experience for my daughter. It doesn't feel right to do that, but I'm out of ideas on how to get HER to speak French to me.

Since we live in the US and I'm the only French speaker around, it's been really hard, and I feel very alone! Plus, I live in a remote area with no other French speakers or clubs, associations, etc. (I actually started a Facebook group for support because of this:
www.facebook.com/groups/FrenchSpeakingParentsInTheUS/ )

I knew that this would be hard, but I was hoping she'd be speaking more French by now. I'm also reaching out to make sure I don't make the same mistakes with my little one.

What am I doing wrong? Is this normal since we live in an English-speaking country? Will she improve?

-Feeling discouraged

Joanna
Senior Keeper

Posts: 226

Country (residing now): France
Country (originally from): Canada
Children, Ages: Charlotte, 4.5 years, James 3 months
Majority Language: French
Minority Language(s): English

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Oct 16, 2017 13:03:12 GMT 9

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Post by Joanna on Oct 16, 2017 13:03:12 GMT 9

I hear your frustration! I'll try to help as much as I can...my daughter will be 3 in March 2018 so...they're a similar age. I think your added challenge is being the only influence....we don't have an English-speaking community around us, but we have my parents by skype. Maybe I'll number my ideas so it's easier to read and chat about.

1) Would your husband be willing to learn some French words, be spoken to a little in French by you? My French husband was successfully brainwashed by me to understand the importance of exposure, so speaks exclusively to our daughter in English (it's not perfect, but it's added exposure).

2) We don't live near my husband's parents either, so the however sad absence of close grandparents contributes to our minority language cocoon.

3) Time. We are strategic with school / childcare so she is 2.5 days at majority language daycare, and the rest with one of us. It's a luxury but if you can find a few more hours somewhere...

4) All this said, my daughter speaks a lot of French. It saddens me...but I persist creatively and it works too. The fact that your daughter understands everything is a big bonus...this means that she has the capacity to produce it too, imo. When my daughter says "C'est quoi ça?" I respond "Wh..." and she responds "What is that?" And we continue our conversation. Her: "Je veux du milk."; me: " I..."; her: "I want milk". Her: "Je veux le faire."; me "I..."; her "I want to do it."

The idea is different than ignoring but rather she only succeeds in communicating in English, and I help her get there, with seriously only the first sound of the phrase she needs. Last night we took a walk and all the way she showed us "gros bâtons" and "gros cailloux". If I was ahead of her and she said "regarde regarde" I simply didn't turn around...sure it seems harsh, but it only took 3 times of this for her to say "look!" and have me turn around excitedly. She's learning, and it's all about turning your frustration at the lack of production into creative energy for solutions like Adam says.

I also appeared very perplexed at her batons, until she told me they were sticks etc.

I think you are doing a lot of things correctly, and it takes time, but you're In a crucial window of time to set the pattern for your communication, so if you can find some changes that stick it will change a lot. Let me know how you do!

English speaking Canadian Mom, French speaking Dad, transitioning to minority language at home (English) with our daughter in France. Our daughter is doing great with English:) recently our son was born.

Jen
New Keeper

Posts: 8
Country (residing now): USA
Country (originally from): USA
Children, Ages: 2 daughters, 3 years old and 7 months
Majority Language: English
Minority Language(s): French

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Oct 16, 2017 22:06:52 GMT 9

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Post by Jen on Oct 16, 2017 22:06:52 GMT 9

Hey Joanna,

Thanks for the replies!

1) Hubby understands French but doesn't really speak it.
2) We live in a remote area, no family nearby. My only remaining French family or friends are all in France. We do facetime only very occasionally.
3) Remote area/no French schools

I would love that too!!!
4) I'll definitely try this.

Thanks for the ideas and advice. I really appreciate the support!

Amy
Star Keeper

***"Shoot for the moon. Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars" - Oscar Wilde***

Posts: 1,682

Country (residing now): France
Country (originally from): France
Children, Ages: 10 and 6year old girls
Majority Language: French
Minority Language(s): Spanish (ml1) & English (ml2)

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Oct 18, 2017 23:16:26 GMT 9

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Post by Amy on Oct 18, 2017 23:16:26 GMT 9

Oct 15, 2017 22:53:45 GMT 9 Jen said:

I knew that this would be hard, but I was hoping she'd be speaking more French by now. I'm also reaching out to make sure I don't make the same mistakes with my little one.

What am I doing wrong? Is this normal since we live in an English-speaking country? Will she improve?

-Feeling discouraged

Welcome Jen,

Keep your chin up, the bilingual journey is bumpy and full of frustrations.

As I read through your post, I really felt for you as it reminds me so much of my own despair over a year ago. You are just facing the terrible influence of the majority language (see Battling the Majority Language Giant (While Feeling Like a Minority Language Gnome)).

We are a trilingual family and my eldest (5 y.o) would only speak the ML (French for us) and made no effort to speak her 2 ml (English & Spanish) though she understood them perfectly. One day, after reading a lot around this forum and Bilingual Monkeys, I eventually came to the conclusion it was the overwhelming influence of the ML that was stifling our 2 mls. My husband and I eventually banned the ML from home (ml@h technique), not just as a family language but also from the media, books, etc. 18 months down the line, my eldest has finally become actively trilingual.

Don't despair!

You just need to find your own technique to trigger the use of the ml by your daughter (though I agree it is easier said than done).

You are not doing anything wrong as such (in fact you seem to be doing pretty well!); passive bilingualism is a common issue in bilingual families. I guess a good way to address it is to create the need to use the language in your child. Ignoring her speaking in ML is an option though I do agree it must not be a pleasant feeling. I once heard a bilingual teacher explaining how she dealt with her pupils using ML in class: she playfully pretended her ears were aching and asked the child to say 2 words/phrases in ml to "cure" her (she taught older kids though). Maybe there is something to take from this.?

My oldest did laugh when I did this a couple of times (at the beginning of the ml@h).

Since we live in the US and I'm the only French speaker around, it's been really hard, and I feel very alone! Plus, I live in a remote area with no other French speakers or clubs, associations, etc. (I actually started a Facebook group for support because of this:
www.facebook.com/groups/FrenchSpeakingParentsInTheUS/ )

Just like you, I am the only ml2 source and feel just as lonely as you do at times.

All I can say is to grit your teeth and keep going. Commitment and steady efforts will eventually pay off.

Bon courage!

Amy

My guest post at Bilingual Monkeys: bilingualmonkeys.com/bilingual-families-and-limiting-the-influence-of-the-majority-language/

My blog in English: www.ourmlhome.wordpress.com My blog in French: bilingue.home.blog

Jen New Keeper Posts: 8 Country (residing now): USA Country (originally from): USA Children, Ages: 2 daughters, 3 years old and 7 months Majority Language: English Minority Language(s): French	Getting toddler to speak in minority language Oct 19, 2017 4:34:34 GMT 9 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by Jen on Oct 19, 2017 4:34:34 GMT 9 Thanks for the support. I'll read the link to the article. Just to make sure I better understand though, would you mind specifying the abbreviations? ml, ML and ml@h? Thanks, Jen

Amy
Star Keeper

***"Shoot for the moon. Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars" - Oscar Wilde***

Posts: 1,682

Country (residing now): France
Country (originally from): France
Children, Ages: 10 and 6year old girls
Majority Language: French
Minority Language(s): Spanish (ml1) & English (ml2)

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Oct 19, 2017 4:56:05 GMT 9

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Post by Amy on Oct 19, 2017 4:56:05 GMT 9

Oct 19, 2017 4:34:34 GMT 9 Jen said:

Would you mind specifying the abbreviations?
ml, ML and ml@h?

ml = minority language
ML = majority language (the language spoken where you live)
ml@h = minority language at home (a strategy used by some parents to bring up their kids bilingually)

All three abbreviations you will often see on this forum. Another common one is OPOL (One Person, One Language, a strategy where one parent uses one language and the other parent uses the other language)

Amy

My guest post at Bilingual Monkeys: bilingualmonkeys.com/bilingual-families-and-limiting-the-influence-of-the-majority-language/

My blog in English: www.ourmlhome.wordpress.com My blog in French: bilingue.home.blog

Adam Beck
Head Keeper

Author of "Maximize Your Child's Bilingual Ability" and "Bilingual Success Stories Around the World"

Posts: 2,176
Country (residing now): Japan
Country (originally from): USA
Children, Ages: Girl, 19 and Boy, 16
Majority Language: Japanese
Minority Language(s): English, Spanish

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Oct 19, 2017 10:54:44 GMT 9

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Post by Adam Beck on Oct 19, 2017 10:54:44 GMT 9

Jen, welcome! Yours is a common concern and the basic challenge involves fortifying the two "core conditions" of exposure and need. So, beyond the good efforts you're already making, what more could be done?

First, let me share with you some of the posts at Bilingual Monkeys that specifically address this issue. I hope you'll find some helpful ideas and inspiration among them...

7 Steps to Get Your Bilingual Child Using the Minority Language More Actively

What to Do When Your Bilingual Child Won't Speak Your Language

Guest Post: Battling the Majority Language Giant (While Feeling Like a Minority Language Gnome) (seconding Amy's suggestion)

Some other ideas that could be productive include...

*Increasing the amount of French resources in your home, to better engage both you and your children in the use of this language. (See Do You Really Have Enough Resources in the Minority Language? (Hint: The Answer is Always “No.”).)

*Taking fuller advantage of online possibilities to connect with French speakers. One suggestion, for example, is Skyping regularly with a "Community Tutor" at italki. I haven't yet done this myself, but plan to, and the cost for a "Community Tutor" (a non-teacher, but still a capable speaker of the target language, which would be fine in your case) is only around $10 an hour.

*Traveling to France (or to another French-speaking part of the world) is a more expensive proposition, I understand that, but this can be a very powerful way to help activate a child's passive language ability. (At my blog, there's a whole series of guest posts called "Bilingual Travelers" and one of these posts was made by Michele Cherie, a mother in the U.S. whose target language is also French. See Bilingual Travelers: Blue Skies and Bilingual Success in France.)

*Attending a French language camp for a similar type of immersion experience, which would be closer to home and (probably) less costly. One highly-rated option seems to be Concordia Language Villages. (See Guest Post: A Monolingual Parent’s Quest to Raise a Bilingual Child for one family's experience of this place.)

Jen, I hope these initial ideas are helpful. You'll find many more, I'm sure, at this forum, at my blog, and in my book. In short, because your basic circumstances have made the odds of success (active ability in the target language) somewhat low, you'll need to be as proactive and resourceful as possible in order to raise those odds and put them more in your favor.

Bilingual SuperKids: Supercharge the success and joy of your family's bilingual or multilingual journey with powerful private coaching from Adam Beck, author of "Maximize Your Child's Bilingual Ability" and "Bilingual Success Stories Around the World"
bilingualsuperkids.com

Jen New Keeper Posts: 8 Country (residing now): USA Country (originally from): USA Children, Ages: 2 daughters, 3 years old and 7 months Majority Language: English Minority Language(s): French	Getting toddler to speak in minority language Oct 19, 2017 22:21:28 GMT 9 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by Jen on Oct 19, 2017 22:21:28 GMT 9 Got it! Makes sense. We are also ml@h in that case. Thanks for specifying! -Jen

Jen New Keeper Posts: 8 Country (residing now): USA Country (originally from): USA Children, Ages: 2 daughters, 3 years old and 7 months Majority Language: English Minority Language(s): French	Getting toddler to speak in minority language Oct 19, 2017 22:23:21 GMT 9 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by Jen on Oct 19, 2017 22:23:21 GMT 9 Adam! Thank you soo very much for the ideas. I'll take a look at everything and read the articles as soon as I can. -Jen

Sam
Junior Keeper

Posts: 65
Country (residing now): United States
Country (originally from): United States
Children, Ages: Boy, 2.5 years old
Majority Language: English
Minority Language(s): Yiddish

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Dec 15, 2017 11:57:36 GMT 9

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Post by Sam on Dec 15, 2017 11:57:36 GMT 9

Thanks for all this -- I actually logged on to The Bilingual Zoo tonight, after a long hiatus, to ask about this very issue. Our boisterous 2.5 year old's language abilities have skyrocketed in the last few months, but mostly in English (the majority language). He's spouting out long multi-part sentences, describing causes and effects, asking questions, and constantly making up silly lyrics to melodies that he knows, etc -- but almost entirely in English. I know that he's capable of simple sentences in Yiddish, but I'm not so sure if he really knows how to form more complicated sentences, like he's learning to do in English in his daycare (40 hours/week in daycare!).

Today I hit a real obstacle with him. For the last couple weeks, if he says something in English, I ask him if he can say it in Yiddish, and often he does (though sometimes he doesn't seem to know how). But the last few days, he's started sighing when I ask him to say things in Yiddish. And then today, he actually said no and refused to say anything at all. It happened a few times today.

A friend of mine, whose eldest Yiddish-speaking kid is in college, often insists that I have to be "der beyzer tate" (the mean father) for a few weeks and just totally ignore anything he says in English. But, like others here, I don't want to be the mean father; I don't want my son to resent his minority language or me, and I don't want him to stop expressing himself creatively with me. I also can't, in good faith, pretend not to understand English, because he knows perfectly well that I understand English.

Here are some things that I've tried doing with him, with moderate success:

-- I tell him I'll give him M&Ms, but only if he asks me in Yiddish. That often works.
-- If he asks me a question in English, I'll say "Yes, but only if you ask me in Yiddish" or "Can you ask me in Yiddish?"
-- If he makes a statement in English, I'll ask him if he can say it in Yiddish, and I'll often give the first syllable or word to help him out.
-- Almost everything he says in English, I repeat back to him in Yiddish.
-- When I ask him to say something in English, and he gets quiet and I can tell that he's thinking, I let him think for 5-10 seconds before jumping in with the answer.

These often work, but even when they do, his Yiddish is much more simplistic. For example, he'll say a multi-part sentence in English, but when I ask him to say it in Yiddish, he'll say a simple 3 or 4 word sentence.

It's really frustrating! And I'm glad to hear that other people have success, but I also know people whose teenage and college-age kids refuse to answer in the minority language, so the parents always speak the minority language and the kids answer in the majority language. In other words, it doesn't always just work out...and I worry about that...

Raquel
Star Keeper

Posts: 1,234

Country (residing now): Spain
Country (originally from): Spain
Children, Ages: daughter (10) & son (7)
Majority Language: Spanish
Minority Language(s): English

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Dec 15, 2017 18:30:47 GMT 9

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Post by Raquel on Dec 15, 2017 18:30:47 GMT 9

Hi Jen! Welcome!

Oct 19, 2017 22:21:28 GMT 9 Jen said:

Got it!
Makes sense.
We are also ml@h in that case.
Thanks for specifying!

-Jen

From what you've said it sounds like what you're doing is OPOL (one parent, one language): you speak French (minority language) to your children and their dad speaks English (majority language) to them. What Amy is doing is speaking English (minority language 2) to their children and husband, while their dad speaks Spanish (minority language 1) to her and their children, while living in France (French being the majority language). They have a majority language-free home, even if they both speak different languages. Does this make any sense?

I always thought we were doing ml@h too, since both me and hubby speak in the minority language to our children and my children have nothing in Spanish at home, but we're now moving toward me speaking in the ml to my husband as well, which I guess is more ml@h than before.

Hope this clarifies all the terminology and what it means.

Dec 15, 2017 11:57:36 GMT 9 Sam said:

I also know people whose teenage and college-age kids refuse to answer in the minority language, so the parents always speak the minority language and the kids answer in the majority language. In other words, it doesn't always just work out...and I worry about that...

I've always worried about this too, Sam.

I guess I'm one of those "mean parents" who pretends not to understand the ML. I didn't use to, because I had heard it was an insult to the child's intelligence and the parent would have to stop using it very soon, because the child would know you do speak that language. But then, when my daughter was 2, a friend of ours pretended not to understand one of her words in the ML and got her to say it in the ml. That opened my eyes, and I started to do the same. My daughter is now 4. She knows that I speak in the ML with everyone other than her and her brother. But she doesn't question it when I 'don't understand her'. It doesn't make her resent the ml either. I really don't see this as being mean, it's just as mean as making them eat green beans even though they don't like them or asking them to say "please" and "thank you" when they'd rather not. I see it as pushing my child to do something that's good for her. Everyone's point of view is different, but just wanted to put mine out there, in case it helps.

Amy
Star Keeper

***"Shoot for the moon. Even if you miss, you'll land among the stars" - Oscar Wilde***

Posts: 1,682

Country (residing now): France
Country (originally from): France
Children, Ages: 10 and 6year old girls
Majority Language: French
Minority Language(s): Spanish (ml1) & English (ml2)

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Dec 16, 2017 6:43:06 GMT 9

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Post by Amy on Dec 16, 2017 6:43:06 GMT 9

Dec 15, 2017 11:57:36 GMT 9 Sam said:

Today I hit a real obstacle with him. For the last couple weeks, if he says something in English, I ask him if he can say it in Yiddish, and often he does (though sometimes he doesn't seem to know how). But the last few days, he's started sighing when I ask him to say things in Yiddish. And then today, he actually said no and refused to say anything at all. It happened a few times today.

A friend of mine, whose eldest Yiddish-speaking kid is in college, often insists that I have to be "der beyzer tate" (the mean father) for a few weeks and just totally ignore anything he says in English. But, like others here, I don't want to be the mean father; I don't want my son to resent his minority language or me, and I don't want him to stop expressing himself creatively with me. I also can't, in good faith, pretend not to understand English, because he knows perfectly well that I understand English.

Hi Sam,

If this can cheer you up, I also feel like my eldest daughter doesn't like it when I ask her to repeat the correct sentence structure. But I still do it. It is for her own good. Our children are too young to know what is good for them, and this is our role as parents to keep at what we think is best for them.

If you think that pretending not to understand the ML is being a mean parent, then be ready for it: I’m the meanest of ALL parents!

I have banned the ML (my own mother tongue!) from my home!

Lol But that was the only way we found to save our 2 mls. It was the only way we could get our eldest daughter to speak her mls. Did she like it? No. Does she still dislike it? Most probably. Does she resent her mls? No.

It is for her own good. Sometimes, being a parent means imposing decisions our children don’t like (and that we don’t always live well with either). Like Raquel beautifully put, it is like when we force our kids to eat vegetables because it is good for them. They don’t understand why now, but they will when they are older.

Hope this made you smile a little and feel better about sometimes having to be a "beyzer tate” to succeed on this bilingual journey. Keep looking for your own tricks to get your son to speak Yiddish, but don’t necessarily shy away from certain “beyzer tate” methods if they might be helpful on your journey: your son is only 2.5 years old - too young to know what is good for him and get everything the way he wants.

Amy

My guest post at Bilingual Monkeys: bilingualmonkeys.com/bilingual-families-and-limiting-the-influence-of-the-majority-language/

My blog in English: www.ourmlhome.wordpress.com My blog in French: bilingue.home.blog

Adam Beck
Head Keeper

Author of "Maximize Your Child's Bilingual Ability" and "Bilingual Success Stories Around the World"

Posts: 2,176
Country (residing now): Japan
Country (originally from): USA
Children, Ages: Girl, 19 and Boy, 16
Majority Language: Japanese
Minority Language(s): English, Spanish

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Dec 19, 2017 11:15:48 GMT 9

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Post by Adam Beck on Dec 19, 2017 11:15:48 GMT 9

Dec 15, 2017 11:57:36 GMT 9 Sam said:

Thanks for all this -- I actually logged on to The Bilingual Zoo tonight, after a long hiatus, to ask about this very issue. Our boisterous 2.5 year old's language abilities have skyrocketed in the last few months, but mostly in English (the majority language). He's spouting out long multi-part sentences, describing causes and effects, asking questions, and constantly making up silly lyrics to melodies that he knows, etc -- but almost entirely in English. I know that he's capable of simple sentences in Yiddish, but I'm not so sure if he really knows how to form more complicated sentences, like he's learning to do in English in his daycare (40 hours/week in daycare!).

Today I hit a real obstacle with him. For the last couple weeks, if he says something in English, I ask him if he can say it in Yiddish, and often he does (though sometimes he doesn't seem to know how). But the last few days, he's started sighing when I ask him to say things in Yiddish. And then today, he actually said no and refused to say anything at all. It happened a few times today.

A friend of mine, whose eldest Yiddish-speaking kid is in college, often insists that I have to be "der beyzer tate" (the mean father) for a few weeks and just totally ignore anything he says in English. But, like others here, I don't want to be the mean father; I don't want my son to resent his minority language or me, and I don't want him to stop expressing himself creatively with me. I also can't, in good faith, pretend not to understand English, because he knows perfectly well that I understand English.

Here are some things that I've tried doing with him, with moderate success:

-- I tell him I'll give him M&Ms, but only if he asks me in Yiddish. That often works.
-- If he asks me a question in English, I'll say "Yes, but only if you ask me in Yiddish" or "Can you ask me in Yiddish?"
-- If he makes a statement in English, I'll ask him if he can say it in Yiddish, and I'll often give the first syllable or word to help him out.
-- Almost everything he says in English, I repeat back to him in Yiddish.
-- When I ask him to say something in English, and he gets quiet and I can tell that he's thinking, I let him think for 5-10 seconds before jumping in with the answer.

These often work, but even when they do, his Yiddish is much more simplistic. For example, he'll say a multi-part sentence in English, but when I ask him to say it in Yiddish, he'll say a simple 3 or 4 word sentence.

It's really frustrating! And I'm glad to hear that other people have success, but I also know people whose teenage and college-age kids refuse to answer in the minority language, so the parents always speak the minority language and the kids answer in the majority language. In other words, it doesn't always just work out...and I worry about that...

Sam, I feel for your frustration. Your efforts since your son was born have been very strong and resourceful, but given the hard reality of the heavy imbalance between your son's exposure to English (40 hours a week of daycare, plus English input from his mother and other sources) and his exposure to Yiddish (almost entirely from you and you're also busy with your own work), I'm afraid this difficulty is a natural outgrowth of these circumstances. In other words, unless you're able to reshape the basic conditions themselves, and somehow tilt this balance more toward Yiddish (a Yiddish-speaking caregiver instead of an English daycare setting?), the creative tactics you're employing, while they can be effective to some degree, will only have impact at the margins and won't really address the underlying cause of this growing gap between his ability in English and his ability in Yiddish.

From your description, it seems your son is simply being pragmatic about making use of his stronger English ability to communicate, particularly as he knows that you have ability in this language, too. How "strict" we should try to be about children using the target language is, in my opinion, highly dependent on each family's particular circumstances. For some families, a very strict approach may be effective; for other families, that same approach could well be counterproductive. And one distinction between them, I think, is that families in which the child receives significantly less input in the target language, and so has less ability in that language, will likely have a harder time being strict about language use than families where the minority language is already a larger part of the child's life.

So you're right, "it doesn't always just work out"; the longer-term outcome is a reflection of the two "core conditions" for fostering active language use: the child must receive ample exposure to the target language on a regular basis and (perhaps of lesser importance, depending on the family) feel a genuine need to use it. In your case, before your son's English grows even more dominant, I advise brainstorming over possible ways (even "crazy" ways, don't edit these out too quickly!) that you could potentially reshape the basic conditions of your lifestyle in order to boost his exposure to Yiddish and bolster his acquisition of this language. (Along with the links I've offered above, please see Principle 8 in my book, "Reshape the Basic Conditions First," which begins on page 140.)

Bilingual SuperKids: Supercharge the success and joy of your family's bilingual or multilingual journey with powerful private coaching from Adam Beck, author of "Maximize Your Child's Bilingual Ability" and "Bilingual Success Stories Around the World"
bilingualsuperkids.com

CHRISTOPHER L WILSON
Junior Keeper

In Chicago!

Posts: 23

Country (residing now): United States
Country (originally from): USA
Children, Ages: Eloise, 8 Benny, 5
Majority Language: English
Minority Language(s): Spanish

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Jan 6, 2018 0:26:58 GMT 9

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Post by CHRISTOPHER L WILSON on Jan 6, 2018 0:26:58 GMT 9

Want to chime in here for supportive reasons and to say I just this morning experienced more or less the same thing. I was naturally conversing with my daughter and she was whining about me opening the door. I simply suggested in ml (since I am the ml speaker in OPOL) that she could ask me nicely to open the door please. She says to me, "no porfavor, just please" which was for me the first time she distinguished between languages in that way! Before, it was always just how does papa say it and how does mom say it. Very interesting and also concerning. You are all not alone and it's helpful to know I'm not alone!

Didn't know how to respond in the moment so just thanked her for being polite (in ml) and kept moving on. Good thing is she currently has 3 four hour half-days in a ml-speaking-only preschool so I'm not alone on ml exposure for the next year at least. She is also 2.5 and in a similar situation.

Happy 2018 y'all, and of course, thoughts suggestions and observations appreciated!

Chris

Christopher L Wilson

Adam Beck
Head Keeper

Author of "Maximize Your Child's Bilingual Ability" and "Bilingual Success Stories Around the World"

Posts: 2,176
Country (residing now): Japan
Country (originally from): USA
Children, Ages: Girl, 19 and Boy, 16
Majority Language: Japanese
Minority Language(s): English, Spanish

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Jan 6, 2018 17:40:33 GMT 9

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Post by Adam Beck on Jan 6, 2018 17:40:33 GMT 9

Jan 6, 2018 0:26:58 GMT 9 CHRISTOPHER L WILSON said:

Want to chime in here for supportive reasons and to say I just this morning experienced more or less the same thing. I was naturally conversing with my daughter and she was whining about me opening the door. I simply suggested in ml (since I am the ml speaker in OPOL) that she could ask me nicely to open the door please. She says to me, "no porfavor, just please" which was for me the first time she distinguished between languages in that way! Before, it was always just how does papa say it and how does mom say it. Very interesting and also concerning. You are all not alone and it's helpful to know I'm not alone!

Didn't know how to respond in the moment so just thanked her for being polite (in ml) and kept moving on. Good thing is she currently has 3 four hour half-days in a ml-speaking-only preschool so I'm not alone on ml exposure for the next year at least. She is also 2.5 and in a similar situation.

Chris, good to hear from you! It sounds like you and your daughter are doing well and I expect that this year you'll experience a lot of satisfying progress. Just keep up that Spanish input! (And preschool will provide a big boost to your good efforts, I'm sure.) You're definitely not alone on this challenging journey and we look forward to hearing more positive developments over the months ahead!

Bilingual SuperKids: Supercharge the success and joy of your family's bilingual or multilingual journey with powerful private coaching from Adam Beck, author of "Maximize Your Child's Bilingual Ability" and "Bilingual Success Stories Around the World"
bilingualsuperkids.com

Sam
Junior Keeper

Posts: 65
Country (residing now): United States
Country (originally from): United States
Children, Ages: Boy, 2.5 years old
Majority Language: English
Minority Language(s): Yiddish

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Jan 8, 2018 5:22:18 GMT 9

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Post by Sam on Jan 8, 2018 5:22:18 GMT 9

Things have gotten a bit better for us, ironically since just a few days after I posted in this thread. He woke up one day and the first sentences out of his mouth were in Yiddish. Probably 1/3 of the time he spoke to me that day, it was unprompted in Yiddish. Since then, he's spoken to me mostly in Yiddish unprompted, and when he speaks to me in English and I ask him to say it in Yiddish, he almost always switches to Yiddish.

I've also noticed the last few days that he's picked up a tricky aspect of Yiddish grammar that is very different from English, and he's using it consistently well. (Instead of saying "I want you to do X," in Yiddish we say "I want, you should do X.") So I don't know what happened; it's almost as if a switch flipped in his head over night! He's still not 100% in Yiddish, and definitely not 100% unprompted, but the difference between now and when I posted in this thread is like night and day.

One thing that might have contributed is that we've been listening to a new CD in the car, and one of the songs is about how wonderful it is when everyone in the family speaks Yiddish at home. So maybe that inspired him.... Maybe I'll try exposing him to some other songs about how great it is to speak Yiddish, as long as it doesn't start to feel too much like creepy indoctrination.... (though isn't EVERYTHING parents do with toddlers indoctrination, to a certain extent?) There's also a new series of 12 Yiddish music videos specifically designed for toddlers that just came out online, and he's been in love with those songs, singing and dancing to them even when the computer isn't on. So maybe that's helped.

In any case, regardless of the mysterious causes, a big improvement in the past couple weeks!

Adam Beck
Head Keeper

Author of "Maximize Your Child's Bilingual Ability" and "Bilingual Success Stories Around the World"

Posts: 2,176
Country (residing now): Japan
Country (originally from): USA
Children, Ages: Girl, 19 and Boy, 16
Majority Language: Japanese
Minority Language(s): English, Spanish

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Jan 8, 2018 7:20:38 GMT 9

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Post by Adam Beck on Jan 8, 2018 7:20:38 GMT 9

Jan 8, 2018 5:22:18 GMT 9 Sam said:

In any case, regardless of the mysterious causes, a big improvement in the past couple weeks!

I'm really glad to hear this, Sam! Thanks for the happy update!

Yes, it can be hard to pinpoint why and when the target language will "click" with a given child--and, to some extent, this is a matter of developmental stages and growing maturity--but it's also true that our persistent efforts, from multiple angles, pave the way for these "clicks" to eventually occur. This is why I regularly stress that There's always a payoff to perseverance. As long as we persist--patiently, playfully, resourcefully--we will experience positive and productive movement over time.

Bilingual SuperKids: Supercharge the success and joy of your family's bilingual or multilingual journey with powerful private coaching from Adam Beck, author of "Maximize Your Child's Bilingual Ability" and "Bilingual Success Stories Around the World"
bilingualsuperkids.com

Raquel Star Keeper Posts: 1,234 Country (residing now): Spain Country (originally from): Spain Children, Ages: daughter (10) & son (7) Majority Language: Spanish Minority Language(s): English	Getting toddler to speak in minority language Jan 9, 2018 20:11:16 GMT 9 Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Back to Top Post by Raquel on Jan 9, 2018 20:11:16 GMT 9 That's great to hear, Sam!! A song, who would have thought?

CHRISTOPHER L WILSON
Junior Keeper

In Chicago!

Posts: 23

Country (residing now): United States
Country (originally from): USA
Children, Ages: Eloise, 8 Benny, 5
Majority Language: English
Minority Language(s): Spanish

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Jan 9, 2018 23:32:55 GMT 9

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Post by CHRISTOPHER L WILSON on Jan 9, 2018 23:32:55 GMT 9

Hi! Good to hear from you all too! Yes, since she entered ml preschool in August 2017 it has been a great plus having increased exposure, adults modeling and speaking the language, and friends her age that speak ml. I'm also excited that my son should be born in the next couple weeks and I feel like hearing me talk to him in ml will also help her see that it's just not her I speak ml with.

I'll post an update when he is born!

Christopher L Wilson

Paivi
New Keeper

Posts: 2

Country (residing now): UK
Country (originally from): FINLAND
Children, Ages: Toddler 2.5yrs, Baby due in April
Majority Language: English
Minority Language(s): Finnish

Getting toddler to speak in minority language Jan 10, 2018 9:43:09 GMT 9 via mobile

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Post by Paivi on Jan 10, 2018 9:43:09 GMT 9

Hello,

I have been wondering about how early to start insisting on the child responding in the same language as spoken to. My son turned 2 in October but is quite slow in picking up both languages. He is however just starting to speed up and shows interest in repeating words that others say. He has a lot of sounds and signs of his own invention that we as a family understand and up until now our main focus has been to respond to any of his attempts to communicate - however he chooses to communicate.

I am the main caregiver and speak the minority language, his father speaks the majority language when he’s around in the evenings and weekends and our common language is the majority language. So, until now I have been repeating whatever he says to me in his “own” language or majority language by using our minority language. Mostly he has only one word or sound or sign for any one object (and that is fairly equally so far divided between the majority, minority and his “own” language) and he is not using sentences in either language. Up until now for example he would say “car” when playing with his toy cars, and I would repeat back to him “auto” in our minority language. Or he would use a high pitched “ooohh” if something is big, and I would give him the word “iso” in our minority language for big. Up until now if I have asked him to say “auto” he would say: “car” and if I asked him to say “iso” he would say: “ooohh” and his answer would stay the same if his father asked him to say “big”. However I have now noticed he has about five objects that he can name correctly in both languages unprompted - a few times when playing with his cars and babbling his nonsensical baby talk he has spontaneously said “auto” as well as “car” - so, is it too early for me to “not understand” the majority language word such as “car” for those objects that I know he can say in both languages and coax him to always use the minority word “auto” instead of “car” when with me?

And how about his first attempts to name anything new?...colours are his big thing and he has been able to correctly point to the right colour when asked in either language for ages now - so he definitely knows his colours. But recently he seems to have deliberately chosen to learn to speak those colours in the majority language - this is his first group of words that he consistently seems to prefer to practice saying in a one chosen language whereas before for example animals or food items have been a mixture of majority, minority and his own sounds. However his pronounciation is way off the actual pronounciation of the colours in the majority language - (blue is “boo”, green is “gee”, yellow is “eeoo” etc). I’m wondering in those instances if I should model the correct pronounciation of the colour in the language he’s trying to say it, or should I just repeat it back in the minority language to communicate by using the minority language that I understand the meaning of what he is trying to say and confirm that he got the colour correct (even if he didn’t really pronounce it right).

I look forward to hearing your thoughts on these dilemmas I have.

Paivi